We’re interested in hearing your feedback about the proposed Transport for NSW Mobility-as-a-Service Data Sharing Specification.
Head over to https://opendata.transport.nsw.gov.au/maas-data-sharing-forum to find out more about the forum (session) we’ll be hosting to get your feedback and ability to download the specification for review.
We’d also like to hear from you about any topics or discussion questions you want raised at the forum. Please post them against this forum thread.
We’ve had some feedback and questions and will be raising and including the following in the discussions on Friday 15 March.
• Use ISO 8601 format for dates and times – this will be incorporated into the proposed spec
• Fares should not be limited to $999.99. Fares can go higher than this. – this will be incorporated into the proposed spec and we’ll take advice/feedback to what level this should go to.
• Should Leg sequence numbers be 0-or-1-indexed? – we will make a call but may need indication what the preference will be.
• Add Ferry to Vehicle Type – this will be incorporated into the proposed spec
• Add Estimated cost to Trip Planning file – great idea and we’ll discuss this during the panel discussion
• To include time in filename for realtime data feed – great idea and we can discuss this during the panel discussion
• How should we publish the vehicle information (Realtime) data feeds? Will it be dropped into a storage location every 15 seconds, or polled from an API we’re to make available? – let’s unpack this further at the forum during the discussion
We also want to discuss further the booking and payment side of things and the role that a transport agency plays.
We’re looking forward to speaking with you on 15 March 2019.
The questions from our interactive tool (Slido) from the forum are as follows:
We’ll post responses to these next week but wanted to transfer the questions to the forum for discussion.
Should there be any questions or comments, please do add them to this thread.
For all those who attended the event either in person or virtually - thank you! We will come back with responses and update the draft specification accordingly.
Thanks for attending the TfNSW MaaS Data Sharing Forum. Please see below for the answers to the questions and feedback posted on Slido and the feedback form.
Questions and feedback from the feedback form.
Q: Use ISO format for dates and times
A: The next version of the specification will include ISO formats for dates and times.
Q: Fare Discussion - how many digits?
A: Discussion about the “cost” of storing extra data was weighed up against the expense of an end-to-end journey and how with MaaS it could include flights – and possibly a first class round the world ticket and would therefore need to be able to allow for that pricing. Also the pricing would need to allow for subscription pricing. Further discussions post the event have lead to the conclusion that we do not limit it in the specification and have the field type set to a floating point.
In addition to the number of digits, a currency field will also be included in the specification. The default for Transport for NSW would be set as AUD.
Q: Should Leg sequence numbers be 0 or 1 indexed?
A: It was decided during the forum that leg sequence numbers would be 0 indexed.
Q: Add Ferry to Vehicle Type
A: Yes this will be added to the Specification.
Q: Add Estimated cost to Trip Planning file
A: Yes this will be added to the Specification.
Q: Include time in filename for realtime data feed
A: Yes the filename will include date and time.
Q: How should we publish the vehicle information (Realtime) data feeds? Will it be dropped into a storage location every 15 seconds, or polled from a provider’s API?
A: The files will be dropped into a storage location every 15 seconds.
These are MaaS operator provided realtime data feeds which we would expect to be updated (voluntarily) such that app developers and trip planners can include the MaaS operator’s availability of services (and other things) in their products.
Q: Ticket types will only be available if the operators have the ability to purchase the different fares on public transport
A: This field is not limited to public transport. Private transport operators who issue different ticket types for their customers should also complete this field.
Q: As travel zone is subject to change over time, considerations should be made not to directly use the TZ16 ID in the tables. Potentially look at options to perform post processing via lookup tables which will give you better flexibility in the future.
A: It is not possible to do post processing as we may not have the actual latitude and longitude to map against lookup tables. Travel Zones data are refreshed every 5 years.
We will update the specification to have an option to use a more generic version of geographical regions. We can then use the generic geographic region and map it to travel zone for analysis. We are investigating what options are available.
Q: Whilst the bookings are being captured as an aggregate, it would be super useful to capture actual booking events in addition to trip_planning events. Knowing if the booking is successful or not can provide useful insights into where the service is not performing well.
A:This will be incorporated into the proposed specification.
Q: It would be helpful to provide lat / long for trip_planning events.
A: This will be incorporated into the proposed specification.
Questions and feedback from Slido
Q: Will the slides be available?
A: Yes
Download Pack
Q: How does sharing live location of vehicles for on-demand services (where vehicle location does not mean availability) help on the trip planning?
A: The real time vehicle information feed will be providing the capacity availability of the vehicle.
It helps customers know where a vehicle is and when it’s on its way once ‘booked’ - validation that the service is arriving.
It also assists in (historic) data collection and analysis for future planning of services.
Q: What historical travel information (detailed Opal, Opalpay, phone ping data etc) will be made available to identify MaaS planners to optimise their deployment?
A: There will be little data that can be released from Transport for NSW beyond what has been released already, however information about traffic conditions are already available through Open Data including real time predictions based on historical data.
We encourage adjacent data service providers to share data with us - such as telcos so further knowledge of the network can be gained. Any information that is being released will be aggregated.
Q: If Maas if seamless travel then who sets fare structure and operates services? why can we use standard format like siri for the model?
A: Fee structures are set by MaaS operators and not set by TfNSW. SIRI is a standard for operational purposes while standards such as GTFS are designed for use by customer facing products and analysis.
Q: Travel history associated with an Opal card is deemed as personal information. How is data privacy protected then through the use of real time Opal data?
A: Opal data will not be released.
Q: What funding is available for businesses to; 1) investigate MAAS solutions 2) trial MAAS pilots eg implementing systems, subsidising fares etc
A: Seed funding was made available for business to explore innovative ideas and solutions to implement MaaS as part of the MaaS Innovation Challenge. No future funding is planned at this stage.
Q: With GTFS-realtime, how can on-demand dynamic-routing technology providers protect exposure or their IP or routing algorithms?
A: GTFS-realtime broadcasts the vehicle locations. It can be tracked to form a route. However, it is complex to reverse engineer to understand the the vehicle routing algorithm when there is a new booking or new pick up being added to existing route.
Q: Agree with the need for more real time Opal data made available to council for better Transport Planning.
A: There is currently no publicly accessible real-time Opal data. Historic analysis of Opal data is produced by the Transport Performance and Analytics team (TPA) within Transport for NSW
Q: It’s a very asset/operator focused framework. If the objective is to use data to drive behaviour change a lot more anonymised customer data is required.
A: There are concerns with privacy of individuals and customer’s data. Currently, there are operators who do not collect customer data and some operators who do not want to share any data. As explained during the forum, Transport for NSW are combining a few sources to form a customer journey and the operator that they are using for the journey.
We welcome any suggestions to improve the collection of customer data which can provide insights of customer behaviour change.
Q: Understand the benefits for an operator in sharing real-time supply data but how does sharing live location of vehicle and trip data help the operator?
A: The information can be used by trip planning apps or websites to display if there is any available capacity for the vehicle and is (these days) expected information from a customer’s point of view. This enables the customer to make decisions on whether to book the operator’s service. It is used to broadcast the capacity of the operator’s vehicles.
Q: Around 70% of NSW journeys are in private vehicles - at best just over 25% of transport data will be A: captured. Are there plans to capture private vehicle data?
There are other departments within Transport that are working on collecting this data.
Q: How will MaaS deal with reliability? Will trips need to change during transit? How will this effect committed additional service offerings?
A: This is a component we’re expecting MaaS apps to handle and to provide the best customer experience.
Q: What feeds are available for availability of wheelchair accessible road transport vehicles?
A: This information is available in the GTFS trips.txt. This information will also be incorporated into the real time vehicle information feed.
Q: Suggest to have bearing in the real-time vehicle information feed so that we know the heading of the vehicle.
A: This will be incorporated into the proposed specification.
Q: Road infrastructure keeping up, eg eternal congestion along and around Botany Road from Redfern, esp Raglan/Henderson intersection?
A: With more data including traffic data and MaaS operator data Transport for NSW will have a better understanding of the network conditions and come up with strategies and plans to mitigate the congestion in affected areas.
Q: What is the interaction between GTFS and TransXchange in the MaaS spec space?
A: TransXchange provides Transport Operations Data. It uses TfNSW Contracted Operators’ data, and feeds into the production of GTFS and GTFS realtime data feeds.
Q: Can we locate travel data by bus route?
A: Unfortunately we do not have this data at this stage on the Open Data Hub. You may request this data for us via our TPA team. More information on bus patronage is available here Bus Patronage | Transport for NSW
Q: What are the panels thoughts on how carpool trips could be brought into the trip options provided, given the dynamic and trust based nature of carpool trips.
A: TfNSW encourages the use of carpooling. This will be possible if the Carpool provider can supply booking APIs or functionality and realtime vehicle information to inform the trip planning app that there is a vehicle heading towards the customer pick up location and the available capacity of that vehicle.
Presentation Pack / Slide Pack used
The presentation pack we used for the session is available for download.
Video of session
Unfortunately our livestream stopped during the panel discussion. We have added a back up video recording to the end of the video so the format changes slightly.
Notes from the session
We have taken notes based on the recording and provided answers to some of the Slido and other questions and comments which have been received as part of the process for gaining feedback about the proposed Specification. These are included in the one document
Still need to review the TMDSS?
If you haven’t reviewed the Transport for NSW MaaS Data Sharing Specification (TMDSS) you can still get a copy of the latest proposed Specification.
Hi Yvonne,
First time forum user. My questions relate to the use of Travel Zone geography.
I would like to suggest that we do not ask MaaS data suppliers to assign a geography. Assigning a geography will require spatial software and business rules for assigning a TZ16.
NSW travel zones stop at the border, this will inhibit analysis of cross boarder journeys. I would suggest that if TfNSW force MaaS suppliers to assign a geography, that we use a Australian Bureau of Statistics SA1 geography.
The SA1 is the ABS building block for analysis and will allow more detailed analysis of demographics.
Identifying duplicate trips. The BTS/TPA spatail team developed some business rules to identify duplicate pass usage from previous projects. In simple terms you require to combine location with time to create a unique identifier for every OD pair. Each OD pair identifies the prior or following OD pair. Simply identify OD pairs with same unique identifier (you can add mode flag if necessary), then compare the adjacent trips, you can run this loop for as many previous or following trips until a unquie string is found. There are few caveats on this method, it relies on the quality of Lat & Long, the translation of lat Long to unique numbers, how you process time. There is also issue of records with no lat long - SA1 geography is smaller than TZ so above method may work with a lesser degree of confidence.
Fares - will journeys include payments made under schemes such as Wheel Chair Accessible taxis? Will MaaS accommodate fare such as provided by Caption Cook for Taronga Zoo - journey price includes entry.
I have more suggestions, when I get time I will jot down questions on confidentity, why lat long are not included in community transport, the opportunity to invite MaaS users to allow access (with incentive) there mobile device to be accessed for purposes of understanding total journey (particularly interchange behaviour).
Cheers
Michael Tanner
Hi Michael,
Thanks for the great feedback!
We welcome all feedback and suggestions. Please send it to us using the following link.
Regards,
Terence